Comments on: Kids And MMA: Explotation or Not? http://www.intentionalfoul.com/time-outs/kids-and-mma-explotation-or-not/ Come Strong Thu, 19 Nov 2009 20:49:41 -0600 http://wordpress.org/?v=abc hourly 1 By: Master GJ Torres Jr http://www.intentionalfoul.com/time-outs/kids-and-mma-explotation-or-not/comment-page-1/#comment-19493 Master GJ Torres Jr Sun, 02 Aug 2009 15:00:51 +0000 http://www.intentionalfoul.com/time-outs/kids-and-mma-explotation-or-not/#comment-19493 Omar Your right about one thing, if instructors and true Martial Artists are going to comment, leave your real name and Dojo, be proud to represent true Martial Arts and stop mess like this from happening. Don't think bussiness or what you say will hurt your because in the long run, true Leaders of the Martial Arts should respect that you have a OPINION on matters of " fake" Martial Arts. John Quincy Adams said " If your ACTIONS inspire others to DREAM more, LEARN more, DO more and BE more, then your a leader" Pat's students needed that type of LEADER, unfortunatly a leader must also lead by example. For you Omar he was all that, unfortunatly alot of parents don't know the difference between good Martial Arts and what's bad, and that not all instant,lil improvments show the school, studio, or dojo are good at making your kids great leaders and if you they knew what their children should be learning, they wouldn't need an instructor to teach them. And for those who say " I don't care if my son or daughters a leader, I just want them to do karate, or learn how to kick butt"..... Tell me any parent who raises their kids to grow up and be followers?? Omar
Your right about one thing, if instructors and true Martial Artists are going to comment, leave your real name and Dojo, be proud to represent true Martial Arts and stop mess like this from happening. Don’t think bussiness or what you say will hurt your because in the long run, true Leaders of the Martial Arts should respect that you have a OPINION on matters of ” fake” Martial Arts. John Quincy Adams said ” If your ACTIONS inspire others to DREAM more, LEARN more, DO more and BE more, then your a leader” Pat’s students needed that type of LEADER, unfortunatly a leader must also lead by example. For you Omar he was all that, unfortunatly alot of parents don’t know the difference between good Martial Arts and what’s bad, and that not all instant,lil improvments show the school, studio, or dojo are good at making your kids great leaders and if you they knew what their children should be learning, they wouldn’t need an instructor to teach them. And for those who say ” I don’t care if my son or daughters a leader, I just want them to do karate, or learn how to kick butt”….. Tell me any parent who raises their kids to grow up and be followers??

]]> By: Master GJ Torres Jr http://www.intentionalfoul.com/time-outs/kids-and-mma-explotation-or-not/comment-page-1/#comment-19492 Master GJ Torres Jr Sun, 02 Aug 2009 14:04:44 +0000 http://www.intentionalfoul.com/time-outs/kids-and-mma-explotation-or-not/#comment-19492 Omar, It is great that your kids had an outlet in Martial Arts, unfortunatly their problem was their instructor. About a year and a half two years ago, TMA came to one of my schools tournaments hosted by Grand Master GJ Torres Sr. Black Dragond Dojo held in Titon Falls N.J., first no one from TMA placed all were defeated. That wasn't the problem, the problem was at the end of the tournament, Pat challenged my full contact team to fight his students 4 on 4,5 point, point fight with everyone in the tournament clearly knowing that TMA wasn't even close to having a chance. Every fighter I had was 200+ pounds, hard hitting, blackbelts, with 10-23 years experiance, they that thought he was joking at first, he was serious. The challenge was so crazy, all of the other instructors at the tournament were pissed, asking him why would he put his studedents through that? And that he was going to kill their self esteam. Tables were turned when my instructor and host of the tournament Grand Master GJ Torres Sr. told "sensei pat" that we will take the challenge, only if he fights GM Torres as the 5th man on the team. Pat started getting nervous studdering saying "nah man today is for my students, I'm not fighting" after numberous attempts, Pat finally agreed. My team was on there "D-game" going in slow motion, while scoring, the only points TMA scored was my team just standing there with their hands down letting them his us, because we felt sorry for them. That's the truth. As for Pat's "fight" it was a verification that he had no business teaching karate, EVER!! He didn't score a single point, flopping all over the place , barley kicking above his waist. He was extreamly out if shape. Unless you count round. It was embarrassing, and everyone thought of TMA as a joke. It was even recorded on video. After the team fight ended I went to the TMA team,they were all crying (seriously, years and all) and told them to make them feel better, that they did good, and they have a lot of potential, their only problem was they have a bad instructor who doesn't care about them, physically or emotionally. I said it right in front if Pat, he just put his head down and the all left. If your kids were there they know me, and know I talked to them. I understand teaching your students to not back down, be strong and have confidence, but Pat did the opposite that day, and will never get respect in the real Martial Arts world. I don't know if what he's charged with is true, but as for Martial Arts as most who have met him, know it's one thing to promote Martial Arts (keep it alive), buts it's another when you teach kids wrong, break them down because of you own ego, making them think the far better then what they truly are, thus killing Martial Arts. And my statement is true, I won't use a false name Master GJ Torres Jr. Black Dragons Dojo (Torres- Hei Long System) Omar,
It is great that your kids had an outlet in Martial Arts, unfortunatly their problem was their instructor. About a year and a half two years ago, TMA came to one of my schools tournaments hosted by Grand Master GJ Torres Sr. Black Dragond Dojo held in Titon Falls N.J., first no one from TMA placed all were defeated. That wasn’t the problem, the problem was at the end of the tournament, Pat challenged my full contact team to fight his students 4 on 4,5 point, point fight with everyone in the tournament clearly knowing that TMA wasn’t even close to having a chance. Every fighter I had was 200+ pounds, hard hitting, blackbelts, with 10-23 years experiance, they that thought he was joking at first, he was serious. The challenge was so crazy, all of the other instructors at the tournament were pissed, asking him why would he put his studedents through that? And that he was going to kill their self esteam. Tables were turned when my instructor and host of the tournament Grand Master GJ Torres Sr. told “sensei pat” that we will take the challenge, only if he fights GM Torres as the 5th man on the team. Pat started getting nervous studdering saying “nah man today is for my students, I’m not fighting” after numberous attempts, Pat finally agreed. My team was on there “D-game” going in slow motion, while scoring, the only points TMA scored was my team just standing there with their hands down letting them his us, because we felt sorry for them. That’s the truth. As for Pat’s “fight” it was a verification that he had no business teaching karate, EVER!! He didn’t score a single point, flopping all over the place , barley kicking above his waist. He was extreamly out if shape. Unless you count round. It was embarrassing, and everyone thought of TMA as a joke. It was even recorded on video. After the team fight ended I went to the TMA team,they were all crying (seriously, years and all) and told them to make them feel better, that they did good, and they have a lot of potential, their only problem was they have a bad instructor who doesn’t care about them, physically or emotionally. I said it right in front if Pat, he just put his head down and the all left. If your kids were there they know me, and know I talked to them. I understand teaching your students to not back down, be strong and have confidence, but Pat did the opposite that day, and will never get respect in the real Martial Arts world. I don’t know if what he’s charged with is true, but as for Martial Arts as most who have met him, know it’s one thing to promote Martial Arts (keep it alive), buts it’s another when you teach kids wrong, break them down because of you own ego, making them think the far better then what they truly are, thus killing Martial Arts. And my statement is true, I won’t use a false name Master GJ Torres Jr. Black Dragons Dojo (Torres- Hei Long System)

]]> By: Chris http://www.intentionalfoul.com/time-outs/kids-and-mma-explotation-or-not/comment-page-1/#comment-17674 Chris Wed, 08 Jul 2009 16:49:19 +0000 http://www.intentionalfoul.com/time-outs/kids-and-mma-explotation-or-not/#comment-17674 A sad ending to a sad situation. Nevertheless, I stand by the information in the this article. Whatever his motivations were, Pat's knowledge about how kids are affected by MMA -- positively or otherwise -- helped make this article whole. A sad ending to a sad situation.

Nevertheless, I stand by the information in the this article. Whatever his motivations were, Pat’s knowledge about how kids are affected by MMA — positively or otherwise — helped make this article whole.

]]> By: robert mclawdy http://www.intentionalfoul.com/time-outs/kids-and-mma-explotation-or-not/comment-page-1/#comment-17672 robert mclawdy Wed, 08 Jul 2009 16:35:11 +0000 http://www.intentionalfoul.com/time-outs/kids-and-mma-explotation-or-not/#comment-17672 Well, it's official Sensei Pat Betterton(he doesn't deserve that title) has admitted to having sexual realtions with a 15 year old (13 at the time) student. So do y'all think he's the best teacher ever. He will be spending the next 6 years as a resident of the state of NJ. He will have to register as a sex offender and will have to under go parole for the rest of his life. Pat had the ability of fool a lot of people, to show them what they wanted to see and not the real Pat. Justice has been served Well, it’s official Sensei Pat Betterton(he doesn’t deserve that title) has admitted to having sexual realtions with a 15 year old (13 at the time) student. So do y’all think he’s the best teacher ever. He will be spending the next 6 years as a resident of the state of NJ. He will have to register as a sex offender and will have to under go parole for the rest of his life. Pat had the ability of fool a lot of people, to show them what they wanted to see and not the real Pat. Justice has been served

]]> By: Feydakin http://www.intentionalfoul.com/time-outs/kids-and-mma-explotation-or-not/comment-page-1/#comment-10081 Feydakin Wed, 25 Mar 2009 19:43:43 +0000 http://www.intentionalfoul.com/time-outs/kids-and-mma-explotation-or-not/#comment-10081 And this is why I left organized martial arts after nearly 20 years in it.. People have to argue over who's school is best, who has the better sensai, who has the better McDojo, and everything else under the sun rather than what this discussion should be about, the kids and whether organized MMA is a good thing for children or not.. You all sound like a bunch of little league parents.. Personally I think if you aren't forced to run barefoot in the snow and spar with "no" pads, then you are play acting at martial arts.. Most of you seem to have no clue what the art is supposed to be about as evidenced by your posts here.. As for the blog post itself.. I am a huge fan of giving kids the skills necessary to defend themselves and compete with similarly skilled opponents.. Competition for children is important.. It teaches them to win with grace, and lose with dignity.. Even in a loss a child can gain confidence in themselves.. It isn't always about winning.. I'm a Hannity fan, and McCain supporter and think that they are wrong on this topic.. About as wrong as you can get.. And this is why I left organized martial arts after nearly 20 years in it.. People have to argue over who’s school is best, who has the better sensai, who has the better McDojo, and everything else under the sun rather than what this discussion should be about, the kids and whether organized MMA is a good thing for children or not.. You all sound like a bunch of little league parents..

Personally I think if you aren’t forced to run barefoot in the snow and spar with “no” pads, then you are play acting at martial arts.. Most of you seem to have no clue what the art is supposed to be about as evidenced by your posts here..

As for the blog post itself.. I am a huge fan of giving kids the skills necessary to defend themselves and compete with similarly skilled opponents.. Competition for children is important.. It teaches them to win with grace, and lose with dignity.. Even in a loss a child can gain confidence in themselves.. It isn’t always about winning.. I’m a Hannity fan, and McCain supporter and think that they are wrong on this topic.. About as wrong as you can get..

]]> By: Omar Pomsetty http://www.intentionalfoul.com/time-outs/kids-and-mma-explotation-or-not/comment-page-1/#comment-10080 Omar Pomsetty Wed, 25 Mar 2009 19:18:03 +0000 http://www.intentionalfoul.com/time-outs/kids-and-mma-explotation-or-not/#comment-10080 Oh, here are some experts discussing Tiger Schulaman's. Just click the first link... http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=forums%2Ff12%2Ftiger-schulmanns-karate-tsk-410463&btnG=Search Oh, here are some experts discussing Tiger Schulaman’s. Just click the first link…

http://www.google.com/search?h.....tnG=Search

]]> By: Tom Ryan http://www.intentionalfoul.com/time-outs/kids-and-mma-explotation-or-not/comment-page-1/#comment-10077 Tom Ryan Wed, 25 Mar 2009 19:12:54 +0000 http://www.intentionalfoul.com/time-outs/kids-and-mma-explotation-or-not/#comment-10077 I have some questions for Sensei Andrew Katz, and if he does so choose to not post anymore, fine, I guess he said that before I posted on here. First off, my son was at your school about five years ago and he hated the classes and you shoved that contract in my face and kept charging me for them. "No refunds". If you're still having trouble remembering, perhaps this will remind you: my lawyer took Tiger Schulmann's to court and I was refunded $850. Now as far as you people nit picking about grappling and wrestling, they are the same thing. Take the UFC. That's grappling, right? Well, it's dominated by wrestlers. And haven't you ever heard of NAGA? Northern Americal Garppling Association. And what do they do? Look at their website "submission wrestling". You're trying to make us look like we don;t know what we're talking about to parents who may not be that informed. Well, I happen to know a lot about the martial arts and MMA. Back to Sensei Katz, I think Jessica raised an excellent point, and I would like you to inform us how credible you are as in instructor. What training in the kick boxing and juijitsu that you teach did you take and under who did you study and for how long? Also, what competitions did you win? My other item is something you did not respond to, however you did address me, so I am responding to your post and asking for what I asked for the first time. Please list all prices associated with your school and also tell us where we can get a copy of that contract. Please do list everything, regular classes, black belt club, gear, testing fee, monthly dues, everything. And tell me, if my son joins back up and doesn't take all the classes, do you give refunds? I have some questions for Sensei Andrew Katz, and if he does so choose to not post anymore, fine, I guess he said that before I posted on here. First off, my son was at your school about five years ago and he hated the classes and you shoved that contract in my face and kept charging me for them. “No refunds”. If you’re still having trouble remembering, perhaps this will remind you: my lawyer took Tiger Schulmann’s to court and I was refunded $850.

Now as far as you people nit picking about grappling and wrestling, they are the same thing. Take the UFC. That’s grappling, right? Well, it’s dominated by wrestlers. And haven’t you ever heard of NAGA? Northern Americal Garppling Association. And what do they do? Look at their website “submission wrestling”. You’re trying to make us look like we don;t know what we’re talking about to parents who may not be that informed. Well, I happen to know a lot about the martial arts and MMA.

Back to Sensei Katz, I think Jessica raised an excellent point, and I would like you to inform us how credible you are as in instructor. What training in the kick boxing and juijitsu that you teach did you take and under who did you study and for how long? Also, what competitions did you win?

My other item is something you did not respond to, however you did address me, so I am responding to your post and asking for what I asked for the first time. Please list all prices associated with your school and also tell us where we can get a copy of that contract. Please do list everything, regular classes, black belt club, gear, testing fee, monthly dues, everything. And tell me, if my son joins back up and doesn’t take all the classes, do you give refunds?

]]> By: Tammy http://www.intentionalfoul.com/time-outs/kids-and-mma-explotation-or-not/comment-page-1/#comment-10073 Tammy Wed, 25 Mar 2009 19:02:50 +0000 http://www.intentionalfoul.com/time-outs/kids-and-mma-explotation-or-not/#comment-10073 I just wanted to clarify something as my final post. I was searching the internet trying to find the article about Pat's arrest and came across this site. I started reading and just couldn't believe what I was seeing so I posted. Then I told Sensei about it. That's how it started - simple as that. No one was waiting for Pat to not be around to defend himself. You can all send your children to whatever school you like. You are all entitled to your opinions and perspectives. I don't need to argue it verbally with you. The "proof is in the pudding" as they say. TSMMA continues to dominate wherever they go. I've been involved with TSMMA for over 8 years now. I did tons of research before deciding where my son would learn the martial arts. I wasn't about to just let anyone influence my child. TSMMA was THE ONLY school that did not have kids teaching their classes. A black belt is a wonderful honor but it DOES NOT QUALIFY ANYONE to teach. TSMMA was THE ONLY school that required their instructors to be CERTIFIED in what they were teaching academically and practically. You are all VERY misinformed about how things operate at TSMMA. You should all stop in some time and see for yourself. Despite all of the terrible lies and rumours you spread about TSMMA, you would still be welcomed to give it a try. And our kids would welcome your kids, help them and guide them because that's just how we are. I feel bad for Pat's family. But the police don't just go arrest someone "just because" - he brought it upon himself. I just wanted to clarify something as my final post. I was searching the internet trying to find the article about Pat’s arrest and came across this site. I started reading and just couldn’t believe what I was seeing so I posted. Then I told Sensei about it. That’s how it started – simple as that. No one was waiting for Pat to not be around to defend himself. You can all send your children to whatever school you like. You are all entitled to your opinions and perspectives. I don’t need to argue it verbally with you. The “proof is in the pudding” as they say. TSMMA continues to dominate wherever they go. I’ve been involved with TSMMA for over 8 years now. I did tons of research before deciding where my son would learn the martial arts. I wasn’t about to just let anyone influence my child. TSMMA was THE ONLY school that did not have kids teaching their classes. A black belt is a wonderful honor but it DOES NOT QUALIFY ANYONE to teach. TSMMA was THE ONLY school that required their instructors to be CERTIFIED in what they were teaching academically and practically. You are all VERY misinformed about how things operate at TSMMA. You should all stop in some time and see for yourself. Despite all of the terrible lies and rumours you spread about TSMMA, you would still be welcomed to give it a try. And our kids would welcome your kids, help them and guide them because that’s just how we are.
I feel bad for Pat’s family. But the police don’t just go arrest someone “just because” – he brought it upon himself.

]]> By: Omar Pomsetty http://www.intentionalfoul.com/time-outs/kids-and-mma-explotation-or-not/comment-page-1/#comment-10071 Omar Pomsetty Wed, 25 Mar 2009 19:01:54 +0000 http://www.intentionalfoul.com/time-outs/kids-and-mma-explotation-or-not/#comment-10071 Here are some links for all the Tiger Schulman’s people. What is a “McDojo”? Not good… I think this pretty much fits Tiger Schulman’s, but you be the judge: mcdojo-faq.tripod.com mcdojo-faq.tripod.com www.bullshido.org/McDojo en.wikipedia.org/wiki/McDojo Equipment Prices (call and just ask, they’ll tell you right off the bat, they are very friendly), why is Tiger Schulman charging so much more?: mtitrading.com/how_to_order.htm Here are some links for all the Tiger Schulman’s people.

What is a “McDojo”? Not good… I think this pretty much fits Tiger Schulman’s, but you be the judge:

mcdojo-faq.tripod.com

mcdojo-faq.tripod.com

http://www.bullshido.org/McDojo

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/McDojo

Equipment Prices (call and just ask, they’ll tell you right off the bat, they are very friendly), why is Tiger Schulman charging so much more?:
mtitrading.com/how_to_order.htm

]]> By: Omar Pomsetty http://www.intentionalfoul.com/time-outs/kids-and-mma-explotation-or-not/comment-page-1/#comment-10065 Omar Pomsetty Wed, 25 Mar 2009 18:56:15 +0000 http://www.intentionalfoul.com/time-outs/kids-and-mma-explotation-or-not/#comment-10065 And as far as the videos goes I don't have any videos of your children, however I do have several of my own children. Tom and others also have videos of their children. Maybe your children are in them but are you saying I can not be recording my own children? Lots of people record little league games and pop warner games. If you would like to email me with your full name and a description of your son, I can see if he is in any videos of my children. karatekid48ob@yahoo.com Also Mr. Sensei, I do not understand why you and your people seem to have seen soemthing completely different than us? Let us just get this straight then. Are you denying that Sensei Audra did what several people said she did? Are you calling us liars? And as far as the videos goes I don’t have any videos of your children, however I do have several of my own children. Tom and others also have videos of their children. Maybe your children are in them but are you saying I can not be recording my own children? Lots of people record little league games and pop warner games. If you would like to email me with your full name and a description of your son, I can see if he is in any videos of my children. karatekid48ob@yahoo.com

Also Mr. Sensei, I do not understand why you and your people seem to have seen soemthing completely different than us? Let us just get this straight then. Are you denying that Sensei Audra did what several people said she did? Are you calling us liars?

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